The Prolific Hub Podcast
The Prolific Hub Podcast is a digital archive of all things life, personal development, spirituality & creativity.
The Prolific Hub Podcast
Ep. 37 | Wellness for Black Women ft. Aseanté Renee
How do you create a life that you don't need to escape from?
Aseanté Renee, a licensed therapist turned executive and performance coach, joins us to share her transformative journey and powerful mission. As the Chief Wellness Officer of The Axon Group, and Founder of Susu House, Aseanté is dedicated to supporting and healing Black women, particularly those in executive roles and beyond who face the constant threat of burnout. This episode dives into her work, including recovering from perfectionism, and the "Retiring Superwoman" campaign.
Don't forget to thank a superwoman in your life today, and remind her to rest!
More from Aseanté:
- Visit susuhouse.org to make a donation, learn more about the Retiring Superwoman Campaign and find upcoming wellness events!
- In need of transformational coaching? Book a consultation with Aseanté today on axongroupinc.com!
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Welcome back to the Prolific Hub podcast. I'm so excited today to be joined by my dear friend, ashante Rene. If you've been listening for a while, you know I have mentioned her a few times on this show that, and I hope that you will find it as valuable and as beautiful as I do. Ashante is a dear friend, she's a mentor and she's actually a former boss at an organization that we used to work at, and I'm just so grateful to have her in my life. So, without further ado, let's jump into the episode. Hi everyone, welcome back to the Prolific Hub podcast. I'm your host, aaliyah Cheyenne, and I'm so excited today to be joined by Ashante Rene. Hi Ashante, hi Aaliyah. Oh my gosh, you should no, okay. So for anyone who's been listening to the show for a while, you know I keep talking about this woman who is a former boss of mine, a mentor and a friend who I have wanted on the show for a long time, and she's finally here. I'm so excited.
Aliya Cheyanne:So Ashante, as I mentioned, is a former boss of mine. We worked at an organization that will not be named, but she brought me on board there and it was just such an honor to work under her leadership and be a part of her team. She has remained an incredible mentor to me. She's the who made me feel like I could even do the consulting thing a couple of years ago and help me with one of my first clients ever, and I have the honor of like supporting her with launching some of her work and doing some comms to support her and social media. I'm just so honored to have you here today. Yeah, I'm going to pause, oh, thank you. Okay, before I get too mushy, shante, I would love for you to introduce yourself. I always ask guests to introduce themselves how they would love to be seen and known in the world today, so I would love for you to share that.
Aseanté Renee:That's such a good question. How would I love to be seen today? I would love to be seen today, as Do Not Disturb.
Aliya Cheyanne:I mean, that's me kind of every day Wow.
Aseanté Renee:So yeah, I'm Ashante Rene. I am the founder and chief wellness officer of the axon group. I'm also the founder and ed of the susu house and I've started the retiring superwoman campaign, and, and, and, and, and I think I want to be, I'm gonna think I want to be known as a protector of black women, as a healer, as a supporter, as an advocate, as a cheerleader, as the whole girl, girlfriend support. I just really love us. I really love us, really love us. And I want to be known as someone who helps us heal, helps us elevate, helps us check out, helps us be soft, helps us be powerful, helps us be mediocre if we choose to like, helps us have agency and determine our own path and our own journey. So, yeah, that's what I want to be known for.
Aliya Cheyanne:Yes, and that you are, because so many of those things you've done for me, so I you know we're doing our podcast, but it's also friend to friend. I treasure you a lot, so thank you, it's going to be just that whole podcast.
Aseanté Renee:No right, I have an issue with Black women loving each other and you shouldn't be on this fight. You shouldn't be listening to this Listen.
Aliya Cheyanne:Part, that part. Okay, so let's get into all the good stuff. So you mentioned multiple things the Axon Group, the Susu House, retiring superwoman campaign so we're going to talk about all of those as their own things. But first can you tell us a little bit more about the Axon group Like, what is the Axon group? Folks who may not be aware of it, and then we'll talk a little bit more about Susu House.
Aseanté Renee:Yeah, so I am a licensed therapist and I pivoted into doing executive coaching and performance coaching, specifically with melanated women and, even more specific, with Black women executives, because we are often the ones that are called in to fix issues that we didn't create, to stand at the edge of the glass cliff which creates burnout, which creates exhaustion, and we are called in to change the world with the resources of the magic school bus knapsack Like you get a pencil and eraser and a peanut butter sandwich. Go fix my organization. You need more resources. Here's some duct tape. Why couldn't you make it work? And so I really just wanted to start working consistently with us around that, and the, the AgSung group is a consulting, performance coaching firm that really focuses on us, with an element that's woven through, that's just connected to our healing, because I think that's the heart of everything that we do, and so I really do help people create lives.
Aseanté Renee:They don't have to escape that, they don't have to take two to four weeks off to go recover from, and they don't have to figure out a strategy because they're already burned out. It's not so much about a dream career or a dream relationship. It's about having a dream life that you actually deserve. So, yeah, great lives where you don't have to escape them. You actually enjoy them. The balance looks like ebbs and flows and, most importantly, I create spaces where you get to be comfortable, to be whatever version of yourself shows up that day.
Aliya Cheyanne:yeah, I, I love that, but the thing that's coming up for me and you saying all of that, is like how are you doing that for yourself?
Aseanté Renee:Therapists make the worst patients and therapists make the worst clients. Actually, all of the stuff that I have created, all the different platforms, come from a place of I wasn't doing this for myself, or I was burned out myself, or I am my own recovering perfectionist, and so what I often tell people is I don't come at this work as an expert. I come at this work as someone who's living it with you, and so I'm walking alongside you in your journey and some areas I have already experienced, so I have knowledge, and some areas I believe you came to me for us to learn from each other. I don't think anything I've been through has been wasted, because it all gets to be an opportunity to be in service of someone else at some point, and so I am helping myself as I'm you know, both have my own resources to pour into me and as I'm helping other women, because you get to see yourself in other people and you know there's moments where you're giving advice or sharing stuff. You're like, ooh, that one was for me too. Hold on, I'm going to go right now when going, so it is a and it is a form of accountability for me, like part of having these platforms and having these companies and having these nonprofits are also accountability points for me. I'm like how can I talk about this? You know and and want this and need this for other women and I'm not doing it for myself. And in what areas am I not doing it for myself?
Aseanté Renee:A great example is an event we hosted for I think the launch event we did for Susu House, and it was about women resting and our healing. We brought in Octavia Rahim at one point and I'm like how can I be talking to people about how they should heal and how they should rest and how they get to pause and I'm stressing out about putting the event on, or I'm stressing my team out about putting the event on? That's counterproductive. We're not going to. Oftentimes with a lot of nonprofits and just a lot of spaces, period, we dismantle the thing outside of our office that we're ultimately recreating inside of our office and I never, yeah. And so these, these platforms are those checks and balances for me where it's like okay, you offer this to other people, where are you doing it for you? And so it forces it to stay present for me, because you know, you know I got the memory of dory if something's not in front of me. I'd be like, oh, that's what's right. Right, I was supposed to be breathing.
Aliya Cheyanne:My bad, my bad my goodness, that is how I, I, I do it for myself.
Aseanté Renee:It's often um, it's often the accountability that I'm working in or the people that I get to work with yeah, I think that's such a beautiful answer.
Aliya Cheyanne:So on a previous episode we had a friend of yours on the show, jen Roberts, the founder of Color Girls Liberation Lab, and she said a quote on that episode where you actually reminded her, like, hey, this work that you're doing is also for you. Like, hey, this work that you're doing is also for you. So I think it's very full circle that you're saying, like, you know, the work that you're doing with Axon Group, with Sisu House, with Retiring Superwoman, is also for you. It's an accountability practice, it's a way for you to see yourselves in the women that you're supporting and it's a way for you to remind yourself like, hey, like I need to be living these principles too. So I think that's beautiful. Thank you, yeah, on that note. You brought up Sisu House in that answer. So can you tell all the peoples what is a Sisu House?
Aseanté Renee:A Sisu House. So Sisu House was also birthed out of. Most of these things get birthed out of a frustration. It's like why don't we have this thing? Okay, well, fine, I'm going to just create something so I don't have to keep asking people and getting told no. On healing equity, specifically as it relates to practitioners and those in the community who may not have the financial means to access different healing modalities, we often talk about equity as it relates to criminal justice reform, social justice reform, education, reproductive rights. I think all of those things are important. I don't like to say but and if we get all these things that we're saying that we want and we are in a more healed space and we are more healed versions of ourselves, we're just going to continue to recreate bad patterns that we have learned. You know it's going to put new wine and old wineskin type of thing. And so Susu House was created to really just work on healing equity, because I think that is the cornerstone of what actual change is going to look like in our society.
Aliya Cheyanne:Yeah.
Aseanté Renee:And part of it was for people who may not have the financial means, because, unfortunately, healing equity is a bit of a privilege. It's a privilege to be able to take a break or take time off if you're burnt out, or to even think about the existential things around. What do I actually need? Who am I If I'm just trying to pay bills? I'm trying to keep the lights on, I'm trying to keep a roof over my head. You know what I don't have time for To go see how a sound bath makes me feel.
Aliya Cheyanne:Yeah.
Aseanté Renee:Because I also believe you know, therapy is not the only like talk, therapy is not the only form or the only healing modality that resonates with people. But if you're trying to just live day to day, you don't have time or access or the privilege to pause and even think through those things. And I wanted to make that accessible to us, especially from an indigenous perspective, because most of these healing modalities come from us anyway and they were taken from us and now sold back to us, and so I just wanted to know what's already innate in us in some kind of way, and so I wanted to offer healing events for free for people to try out what may work for them or what you know for them, to get curious about different ways that they can access resources that will just help them in whatever trauma they're working through, be it talk therapy, human design, astrology, sound bath work, reiki work, energy work, chakra work, herbal work, whatever that means for you and connected to whatever that means for you and your religious beliefs. I didn't want there to be a financial barrier to that. Finances shouldn't stop someone from being able to heal through trauma. Secondly, I wanted to make it equitable for practitioners, because a lot of practitioners that look like me go into this work to work with people that look like us, and we also have to be able to pay our bills, and so there's a frustration around.
Aseanté Renee:I want to help my people, but my people can't afford my rates. So how do I, you know, have a sustainable life for myself and help my folks? And so, coming in and making sure with the SUSO House, when we do events, we pay practitioners their full rate. Sometimes you pay them more than the rate that they're offering You'd be like. No, actually, you know, from an equitable perspective, we never pay a practitioner less than a particular amount, and so it always is that or above, and so giving them a chance to actually get introduced to more people, aid their full rate for what they're doing, do the thing that they're gifted and call to do and love to do, and it invites people in to try something new. Without money being a factor. We just basically raise a lot of money and then put it back into the community to do healing events for folks, to build community and take what they need from that.
Aliya Cheyanne:I love that. I feel like for any, for any Caribbean people that are listening. They're like Susu pasa pasa.
Aseanté Renee:Yes, partner, yeah, I mean it is our time, right, our time in this particular way, and so you know the, the practitioners are, you know, trading their time for me, and then the community is trading their time, and then I'm kind of the middleman, or Susu is the person in the middle or the entity in the middle, just kind of creating. It's the house, like everybody gets to come into the house. So like you come into the house you go eat good, you don't have community, you're going to laugh, you're going to enjoy each other, and so Susu, isutsu is that entity. It's that house that folks get to come into to figure out what works best for them.
Aliya Cheyanne:Yeah, and I think what you're doing is so important creating more accessibility, really, for people who either don't have access or who want to provide the service, but they also need to survive this capitalistic hellscape. You know, we all have to participate to the degree that we need to to survive until something better comes. So I love this just kind of merging of providing more support in that space, where people who need it, who might not be able to afford it, can come to the house and get what they need and the people providing the service can also be supported in the work that they're called to do. So I think that's really special. Okay, so we're going to talk about more of this stuff.
Aliya Cheyanne:There's so many things around this. So you already spoke about, like, what led you to creating these things, because you recognized a lack or you felt like you needed it as well. So that launched you into wanting to provide the support through the Susu House and the Axon Group, and I think that's wonderful. But I often ask people about purpose. So I feel like identifying a need and identifying and creating this entity to serve this gap is one thing, but I'm often really curious about what calls people to their purpose. How do you know what is the thing in your body, what is the thing in your spirit and your mind that affirms you that this is your purpose, your purpose, so, in what way does the Axon group.
Aseanté Renee:Does Sisu House fuel your purpose as a person in this world? I've read a quote recently and I'm going to kind of butcher it, but the essence of it is your purpose is the thing that you do that lights you up, that also serves, that helps people right, that serves the world.
Aseanté Renee:And these things don't feel like work to me. They don't feel like the old adage, you know, do what you love and then like, if you get paid for it, like that's bonus or that's extra, like in a non-capitalist way. But these things don't feel like work. They feel like a culmination of the experiences that I've had throughout my life, the wisdom that I have gained, the mistakes that I have made, the trauma that I have been through. These things feel like, well, that was the training ground. That was the training ground for this. This is why I went through that. This is why I experienced that situation. This is why I made that horrible mistake to learn, so I could be here, so it wouldn't be wasted. And so it doesn't feel like work. It feels like confirmation of the life that I have lived so far. That's how I know it's a part of my purpose. It feels exciting.
Aseanté Renee:At the heart of it it feels effortless.
Aseanté Renee:The execution and those pieces take energy and take work and can be stressful.
Aseanté Renee:But at the heart of the idea, the purity of the idea, the motivation behind the idea of these things feel effortless and they actually give me life, like when I see a Black woman have like an aha moment in a session or I see you know someone sitting like at a sound bath, because I've never done something like that before and they're like I just see tears coming down their face and they're like I don't even know what this is, but I needed that.
Aseanté Renee:They may not ever go do that again, but in that moment they got to feel loved on, they got to feel seen, they got to feel cared for and I'm like that's it, that's it. And every single time something like that happens and it's like that's the, that's the work. Yeah, like for a lot of us, it's like I am a healer, at the heart of all of what I do and I've had a lot of roles and a lot of industries and I've gotten to a point where the I realized the through line of all of that was helping people and helping people heal, and because in helping other people heal, it's helping me heal my own stuff as well yeah, yeah.
Aseanté Renee:And so it doesn't feel like work to me.
Aliya Cheyanne:Yeah.
Aseanté Renee:It really doesn't. It feels like second nature.
Aliya Cheyanne:Yeah, I think that's a beautiful answer. Do I often lean on something like that quote that you shared at the beginning? That, like you know, think about what you would do for free, just because it brings you joy and it makes you feel good and you're helping others and it lights you up. That is likely the thing that will help to align you with your purpose, like if you're feeling lost or unsure, and I think your answer is just a beautiful thing that just supports that idea. Like this is second nature for you. It feels good and I love that answer.
Aseanté Renee:People. It's like I don't want to get paid for it, because the moment money comes into it then it feels like a burden and it it taints a little bit. And so for some folks purpose may not be something that pays you, For others it is. But either way, knowing what that thing is, that like lights you up and fills you up, kind of feels like your North Star, is good to learn, and it took me a very long time to get there. A lot of I learned it by learning all the things I do not enjoy.
Aliya Cheyanne:Yeah.
Aseanté Renee:It wasn't what I was, like I want to be a healer. I was like, no, I want to be a dentist, but I was fine, yeah. So I was through like so many iterations of roles and responsibilities and things where I it was right for me in that season but it was not. And it was right for me in that season, but it was not what I was supposed to experience in that season.
Aliya Cheyanne:But it was not my purpose, but it was getting me closer and closer to my purpose. Yes, yeah, exactly. Kind of like the Alchemist, yes, which I'm currently rereading because I read it many years ago. I'm someone when I read, I highlight things that stand out to me. So it's very interesting to me now to be rereading it and like looking at my old highlights, like does this still resonate? Am I highlighting new things? Because I'm in a different season and the messages are landing differently for me. I love that.
Aliya Cheyanne:And just leaning into, like you said, like sometimes your purpose ain't always going to pay you, like there's this culture now about monetizing every single thing, even things that are like you know what you feel passionate about, and for some people it does work out to do both and for some folks it doesn't. But really leaning into that thing that lights you up and brings you joy, like that will help to bring you to that purpose. And going through phases and seasons and stages that also help to bring you closer too, because somebody's roles they may be tough, but they help us to weed out what we do and what we don't want, what we do and what we don't need.
Aseanté Renee:And if you are in a job where you're like this is not my purpose but it pays bills in a way that allows me to lean into my purpose. So I think also expanding this very prescriptive idea of like what it looks like to be happy or live a particular type of life.
Aliya Cheyanne:Yeah, yeah, I feel like you've touched on this in many ways, like just identifying what you wanted to create in the world, leaning into what feels good to you. But I feel like there's always. There are always these moments and instances and events that kind of like catapult us into charting our own paths and becoming entrepreneurs and solopreneurs. What was that moment or that feeling for you where you just kind of knew, like I need to, I need to do this thing, like I need to take it seriously, I need to pursue this. What was that moment for you?
Aseanté Renee:I'm laughing because I don't think it was one moment. Okay, it was a series of events where it's like, if you're a woman, one time, like I've been, I wasn't catching it. I wasn't catching it. Uh, I think it was after, like you know, the like people say, like death by a thousand cuts. It was kind of like realizations by a thousand WTFs.
Aseanté Renee:I was like what in the? I was like, okay, what are all these different things? Tell me? Yeah, and even then it wasn't something I was sure of that there was. There wasn't a aha, oh my gosh, I need to be an entrepreneur and do this on my own. That was not it. Like I was not a I'm about to be an entrepreneur, but no, it was none of that. It was I can't do these things anymore, like this, I don't. I'm going to start doing this instead. So I went out of options playing the game the way that I was told to play it, and I didn't know what else to do. So I just started doing this other thing and then realized, oh, that's what it's called. Okay, cool, great, that's what we'll do.
Aseanté Renee:But it wasn't that I stumbled into it, it wasn't some amazing epiphany declaration, it was just like that has to be something else. I can't work in this space this way. I can't work with these particular constraints, I can't work with these philosophies being the thing that people often work and live by and I'm going to be honest with my former employers I'm pretty sure that didn't make me a great employee, because I was constantly like wait what? No, I don't like that, wait what. So, if any of y'all are watching and someone has passed it to you, I am aware now in my 2020 hindsight wisdom, it probably didn't make me that great of an employee because there was constant like why are we doing this, like this? Like why?
Aliya Cheyanne:does it make sense.
Aseanté Renee:It's like, well, so much of that makes sense, Then you go do it. I guess I'll go do it, yeah, and so there really wasn't a a um, like uh-huh.
Aliya Cheyanne:Yeah.
Aseanté Renee:Now it was.
Aseanté Renee:It was a series of continuous I know what I don't want, I know what I don't want, I know what I don't like, I know what's not working and if I'm going to stay in these very specific restrictive spaces, I have to play by those rules.
Aseanté Renee:Like you can't get mad at rules and then stay in the space that's perpetuating the rules, like if you don't either conform to it or do something else, because at that point you're like now you're just being disruptive for no reason and so I'm like, all right, well, let me just leave and go do something else. Then, yeah, and that's kind of how that happened, and it was a slow roll, like I slowly like rolled into doing my own thing and then picked it up and you know what I started, what Axon started out, as it no longer looks like that, and then being okay, yeah, being okay with the evolution of what my company looks like, being okay with the evolution of what Susu looks like and what it offers, and not having to have it all figured out and the recovering perfectionist in me Does not like that At all. No part of me enjoys that Piece of the journey. It's part of the journey. So, yeah, that wasn't one thing.
Aliya Cheyanne:Yeah, I love that the analogies you shared, but also the language of it wasn't one thing. Yeah, I love that, the analogies you shared, but also the language of stumbling into it, because sometimes there, like you said, there isn't an epiphany, like sometimes you just learn along the way and sometimes you're tripping and stumbling and falling into it, but eventually you figure it out and you learn how to fall better.
Aseanté Renee:I'm still tripping, but I'm like I know learn how to fall better. I'm still tripping, but I'm like I know I'm a fall. It's like I know I can't wear these heels, but I know I got eight steps before I fall again. Before I didn't know I had eight good steps. Now I know I got eight good steps before I fall again and I know how to fall. Now I'm not going to fall for it, I'm going to fall for the side. So I just mess up and it sits. That's all I got.
Aliya Cheyanne:I'm just, I'm all better at this point, I know I like I literally just had an image in my head of when I was younger, trying to wear heels that I had no business wearing and like I really could work walking them every step. I was like every step I was stumbling and my ankle was just kind of like like going like this, but I I held my head high, made it to my destination and I took them joints off.
Aseanté Renee:Look, look, you know and I know there's supposed to be this I think oftentimes we look to have people be experts so then they can tell us what to do and tell us how to respond to a thing, and I'm like, I'm sorry, most of us don't know what we're doing either. Much more honest and normalizing the like y'all. I'm still falling, like I feel. Two days ago I was like, oh, that was a bad idea. Okay, noted, yeah, it's a series of just learning how to fall.
Aliya Cheyanne:Yeah, and navigating hardships, because this no path is easy, but this one, especially when you're trying to figure stuff out, it can be really tough. So thank you for that. I would like to talk a little bit more about the recovering perfectionists, because you've mentioned it a few times and I know that is an aspect of your work as well a few times, and I know that is an aspect of your work as well. So it sounds super self-explanatory, but folks who might not understand.
Aseanté Renee:Can you break it down? What and who is the recovering perfectionist? I, I am, she, we are. Yeah, I realized a few years ago, after you know most major transitions in your life, you kind of start to do an evaluation of everything in your life and one of the things that came up was how much of a perfectionist I really was. And I had the epiphany and called a homegirl to be like, oh girl, I've had, I realize I am a perfectionist and I, you know, silence on the phone and I'm like she's taking it in too, because I was a yep, that was good. And then she's still silent on the phone. I'm like, hello, yeah, I'm like, oh, she must really be feeling this, like she's processing it, like I processed it, and I'm like, girl, you heard me, she me. She's like, yeah, wait, what? That was all a response.
Aliya Cheyanne:It was that kind of silence. Okay, hold on.
Aseanté Renee:Read that wrong. What Girl I thought you knew. You know. She said it's new to you. I really thought you knew you were a perfectionist. I did not. I thought I was coming to you with new information. Come to find out. I'm the last to know.
Aseanté Renee:So then I started calling more and more friends and they're all like girl. Maybe it's like is this a? Are we playing a game? Like, what's that? How do you not know? I thought what. And so one, my epiphany and revelation was not that deep because everybody else knew, but me. So that hurt a little. But you know, it really started this process of really leaning into. Well, how did I get here, like, and what does this mean? I know what you know. Sometimes people use perfection. It's like oh well, what's your, what's your biggest weakness? I'm a perfectionist.
Aseanté Renee:I was like actually, yeah, actually that's a thing yeah and I really started to lean into what that meant for me. It came to the realization, specifically with melanated people, that perfectionism is a coping mechanism. It is a trauma response because of all the generational trauma we have experiences. It's not just like I just want to be the best because I'm type A and I have to know. This is actually about safety, like us being perfectionists and us using perfectionism as a coping mechanism is actually about our safety. If I can anticipate everything, if I can cross every T, if I can nod every I, and if I can know everything that's happening before it happens, I won't be blindsided, I won't be caught off guard, I won't be harmed. And so I really started to unpack what that actually meant, which is why I started calling myself a recovering perfectionist, because I think it is something that is going to take a lifetime to unpack and undo for myself, and it also, as a recovering perfectionist, gives me grace, like if I'm in recovery, there are going to be days where I'm like, oh, I was not.
Aseanté Renee:I was a little more perfection, a little less recovery today.
Aseanté Renee:It was a little more perfection, a little less recovery today, and so I started doing work around that. It started when I would talk to a lot of my clients and just talk to other Black women, it's like, oh yeah, I'm a perfectionist, oh, I'm recovering from that, and it just became such a real. It just really started to highlight how, oh, this isn't just my issue, this is something out in the world and we just don't have words for it yet, and people really hadn't connected trauma to perfection, like being perfectionist because of our trauma, and so I just really started to lean into that and started teaching workshops around it. I'm currently working on a book, talking about it and talking about it through the lens where we center melanated women, specifically Black women, oftentimes self-help books, center whiteness and we have to contort ourselves into ways to make the language make sense to us, and so I want to start with us as the center, and so you know most book coming out, hopefully in 2025 around that particular thing and how to care for ourselves and how to do that.
Aseanté Renee:So right now there's workshops and, just you know, talks and conversations and yeah things and stuff like that, just to really unpack why we, why we use this as a coping mechanism, the different types of perfectionists that people may show up as because it's not all personalities, right, like people who don't have type personalities still engage in perfectionism, people who are procrastinators that is a science on perfectionism, right, you're like, well, if it's not perfect and I can't get it, just right, I'm just I'm just going to right. So, um, kind of live in the realm of perfectionism that we don't realize are actually, you know, a part of that coping style. And so just bringing that to light and, with most things, normalizing it in a way where people just don't feel like there's something wrong with them, like there's nothing Right, like a lot of times clients come to me and I'm like, let's start with you're not broken. You are not broken and so you do not need to be fixed.
Aliya Cheyanne:We do.
Aseanté Renee:Let's start there, like and you already have everything you need in you to heal and now you bring in all these resources to help support that. But please know, the work that we are doing is not because you were broken and you need to be fixed and you need to be fixed. It is because you have survived certain traumas and now those survival tactics may not be needed anymore and we need to figure out what to replace it with. So perfectionism has served us and because it creates positive results, we think it's a cheat code. In actuality, it is something that's eroding the most authentic version of ourselves.
Aliya Cheyanne:Yeah, I love that and that's just such a beautiful explanation and it gives people an opportunity to really if they feel like they identify with that term and that title to really think about how perfectionism has showed up and served them, whether that's because of trauma or certain environments or disadvantages or different things they've had to navigate in life that formulated their personality that way, and how to kind of step out of that and step into your body and inner knowing about how to like navigate it.
Aliya Cheyanne:Once where they were trying to make the case for leaning away from that term, but when you actually read the article, they're talking about a lot of the same things. It's about how we've come to identify this way because of certain disadvantages in life or certain environments, certain things that have made us hard and become like this, and, instead of leaning into hopelessness and trying to become this flawless person, like embrace this aspect of yourself and like learn how to work around it. And I'm just kind of like well, I understand what you're saying but at the same time, part of breaking away and doing better is, you know, some aspect of healing, some aspect of of recovery, some aspect of looking at things differently. So I think you know your explanation is beautiful and I cannot wait for the book to come out. I will be reading it.
Aseanté Renee:I'll be adding it to my library either you know what a recovering perfectionist I want to do write a book about all the ways they've been a perfectionist and then share it with the world, with the world they messed up, yeah, but the more I write, the more I'm like, oh, this was not a good idea. It's still so sad and challenging. Oh so, yeah, so that article you're speaking about it's the. I also think people with different experiences get to use words differently yeah yep, yep.
Aseanté Renee:I think it's easy to say like, oh, it makes you feel hopeless. If you're a recovering perfectionist, I'm like, yeah, if you've always operated from the space of hope and opportunity and access and privilege, if you've never operated from those spaces, it's the saying you're a recovering perfectionist gives you permission to be human. Yeah, it gives you permission to take time to figure it out. Permission to take time to figure it out, it gives you permission to get over a breakup and then, three years later, hear a song by you know, or hear a song by, I would say, brian McKnight.
Aseanté Renee:bless his heart he can't get, he can't get like hear a love song from the nineties, I'll just say that. And all of a sudden you're crying. Right, yeah, I thought I was done with this. I thought calling yourself a recovering perfectionist gives you permission to be like, yeah, that particular season of that thing I did heal. And this new emotion I'm feeling is triggering something on a new level. Right, shout out to all my elderly millennials, super Mario Brothers, like, yeah, you healed level three, but now you're on level eight and level eight. These same things are coming up and that's okay. And so I think, saying you can't, you also just saying you shouldn't use a word anymore. It's like who are you? How dare you? Cause you don't know who that word or what that phrase, how that resonates with people. And so just the privilege of saying we have to throw this away, we can't use this anymore, already speaks to your privilege around the thing. But when I say it, when I say recovering, perfectionists.
Aliya Cheyanne:I am inviting people to give themselves the permission to be human, messy, and that's so important. That's so important, especially being in a world that tells you you have to act a certain way and be a certain way. Like I'm in an era of just showing up as myself, like my authentic self, my, like my messy self, my sometimes wrong self, like listen, I'm a person I keep seeing this language around and it's certain pages that I follow that really explore just grief and things like that. But just giving yourself grace because, depending on what you believe in, we're all just doing life for the first time. Like it doesn't matter how old we get.
Aliya Cheyanne:In the grand scheme of the universe, we're all babies. We're just babies and we're here for the first time experiencing life. So it's I think about that a lot when I'm trying to give myself grace, when I make mistakes, or when I'm trying to give other people in my life grace or maybe something affecting me in a way that wasn't intended that we're all just doing life for the first time. We're all figuring it out together. So I love the idea of just embracing your fullness, flaws, mistakes and all, and just being more human, because that's what we are at the end of the day, like I, why didn't I know how to do that?
Aseanté Renee:because you didn't. Yeah, just yeah. And that is hard, and I say that with the. I have to tell myself that quite often. So sit with whatever you need to sit with around that, ashanti, and now figure out how you're going to manage, because so many of us are human. Most of the time people aren't doing something against you, they're doing it for themselves, like people are for themselves. They're not against you, yep, yep, and that's a really hard thing to sit with, right, like they're not trying to come for you, they just trying to help themselves. And then and in them helping themselves, a ripple effect may harm you, yes, the consequences of it and the impact of it, not minimize it.
Aseanté Renee:But it's not always someone's out to get you sometimes they are but it is not always that when someone, especially when it's people that you care about, Most of the time, when it's them, it's not.
Aseanté Renee:Yeah, right, like let me put that caveat out there the people that love and actually care for you. When they do something that's hurtful or harming, or disturbing or frustrating or deeply disappointing, they're not doing it to harm you. They are not doing it to harm you. They are doing something in support of themselves. Yeah, and the ripple of the effect of that is harming you. It's yeah, impact still gets to be the impact, and it's not necessarily intentional yeah, yeah, thank you for that.
Aliya Cheyanne:I think that's. That's excellent. Nothing to add there. Yeah, just sitting with that for a moment. Okay, so we've mentioned the Retiring Superwoman series. Like, we've mentioned it, we haven't gone in depth about it, so please can you talk to us and tell the audience more about what is the Retiring Superwoman Like? What is the series that you've launched? Can you talk to us a little bit more about it?
Aseanté Renee:retiring superwoman came up because I'm tired, because I was trying to do all these things in 2023 and 2023 kicked my butt like it was really rude like it was really 2023 was rude, I'm like. If you don't want to be here, why did you show up? Like you could have just quietly quit and not brought me your?
Aliya Cheyanne:drama 2023.
Aseanté Renee:Yeah, you, yeah. Why are you coming for me?
Aseanté Renee:and I just ended up not practicing any of the things I preached to my clients, which was accountability piece, and I realized just how tired I was and how over it I was, and this was a new level like so what does your authentic self look like? And so retiring superwoman came to be because I was in a session with somebody or a workshop or a panel or something and we were talking maybe it was the glass cliff, I think it may have been something with the female quotient, I'm not sure, but we were talking about, like, our labor and what that means, and specifically for black and brown women, and it was just our, our value. Because of slavery, our value was literally connected to our labor and our yeah, like that's the only reason we were valuable in society's eyes is is what we put out, what we were able to do, what we were able to accomplish and I know things have shifted over time, but have they?
Aliya Cheyanne:there's have. Well, we like slavery. Has it ended?
Aseanté Renee:no so part two, we will be getting racial analysis of the new Jim Crow. The new we'll get into those, yes, but it hadn't, because then we'd internalized it right. So it was the I'm the strong friend, I got to handle it, I got to take care of it, I'm the one that people call on, I'm the one that blah, blah, and on some level it turned us into a martyr and I can speak for myself. I realized it had turned me into an interesting martyr victim. I started playing in that cycle and that dynamic and then I realized I enjoyed it, like I liked being the martyr, because then I could feel like, oh, look at what's happening to me, look at how people are. I'm like, well, but you agreed to do some of these things that you're not being mad about.
Aseanté Renee:You agreed to participate in X. You didn't set a better boundary here, and sometimes you don't know the boundary you should set until you have to set it. Yes, and sometimes these boundaries are much harder, especially in the families oh yeah, 100% of the family dynamics and so everybody started to get me it. It allowed me to start really unpacking. Wait, my value really is in my labor and that, in conjunction with the recovering perfectionist piece like if I put stuff out, then I was enough, like it all came.
Aseanté Renee:It was very external and it wasn't about the fact that I could just do this. The fact that I am present, the fact that I am here, the fact that I can breathe, that may be valuable, but that also isn't something that messaging, isn't expressed or acknowledged in society. Right, it's about what you can do, what you can bring to the table, and so well you can. And so retiring superwoman really became like a cultural movement where we prioritize the well-being of others. Like we explore how we prioritize the well-being of others, like we explore how we prioritize the well-being of others and how we can set better boundaries for ourselves, how you could no longer come from our labor or our sacrifice, or our resilience or our exhaustion, and I really kind of like declared war against the word resilience, like I actually despise that word because it is used as a badge of honor. Like, oh, you're so resilient, how about we get to a point where I actually don't have to get knocked down and get back up, and then that be celebrated? How about you just don't knock me down?
Aliya Cheyanne:How about?
Aseanté Renee:we don't even bring resilience into the conversation, because resilience means I am able to withstand a hardship. How about we take out the hardship? I'm sorry the fact that I can take a punch.
Aliya Cheyanne:Because you're so strong and you're so resilient. I mean, how about no?
Aseanté Renee:So retirements is a campaign similar and it's under the Susu House where we're exploring like one where we have started to internalize, where our value is all about our production and external things, where we're also playing into that role, where we're refusing to take the cape off ourselves, like where we're adding. You know, we're perpetuating this thing that we say we want to be differently or we want to be different, and then what we can start doing to change that and it's not major life overhauls, because I hate when people like all you have to do is just start loving on yourself more.
Aseanté Renee:It's just more self-love and deep breathing. Ma'am, if I knew how to do these things consistently, I wouldn't be in the position that I'm in right now. Facts Don't just say all you have to. Anytime someone says all you have to do is nope, shut up, I'm not talking to you. I'm not talking to you, that's all I had to do.
Aseanté Renee:And so retiring superwoman is being very honest around. You may be in a meshed family dynamic where you can't just start saying no to everything because something may not get done, someone may not get the care that they need, and so you can't just be like I quit, I'm done with it. Or you may have a family and children where you still have to care for them. Or you may be in a certain dynamic of situation, professionally or in friendships, where I can't just be like new boundaries for me, new boundary alert. I'm not doing this like that.
Aseanté Renee:That may not be what actually works for you in this particular season, but you can build up to that. You can actually start asking questions now and getting curious about how showing up in these roles is still serving you, because we don't do anything that doesn't serve us, be it healthy or unhealthy. So let's just start becoming aware around, like why does this identity mean so much to you? Why are you holding onto it? Let's start unpacking that. And then let's start figuring out how you can start seeing the value in just you being in this world, and then let's start doing some activities around that so that muscle can get built up. And then maybe let's start identifying just one area, not a whole life overhaul, but one area where you start practicing a better boundary for yourself.
Aseanté Renee:Yeah, hold that muscle up and then it builds, and it builds and it builds. But understanding that this has been ingrained in us for centuries, we're not going to, in one workshop, in one training, in one retreat, in one book, change this superwoman mentality. And so again, it's the retiring, it's the recovering, it's the ING of it. Like I'm intentionally using this, you know words matter to me. I'm intentionally using the ING in these words to understand that it is a process to help, to get people permission to take their time through this. And in some cases they'd be like I don't want to work on being a retiring superwoman, I don't have the capacity for it.
Aseanté Renee:But the campaign a little bit back to the campaign. We partner with local Black-owned businesses and give people, melanated, women, an opportunity to come in and receive something or a discount on something at no cost to them, to remind them you don't have to do anything to receive something or a discount on something at no cost to them, to remind them like you don't have to do anything to receive something kind, you don't have to do anything to receive a gift, you don't have to do anything to be loved on. And so one of the places that we went was Brooklyn Tea in New York. Shout out to diversity. Shout out to Ali Wright, one of my hands and alum. You know, brothers in the world, he's a co-founder of Brooklyn Tea, and so we had one evening from five to seven. If you came in, you got $10 off whatever thing you purchased, no questions asked If you were a melanated woman $10 off, no matter what it is yeah
Aseanté Renee:if you want to know more about retiring superwoman, great. If you just wanted to get the free thing and be out, you get to do that as well, but it's a space for people to just be poured into with no strings attached. Yeah, and so we did this with a few different um businesses in the area and they're looking to expand that to other cities where we can just come in and do you know retiring superwoman events where you literally just get to come and get loved on and get something free that helps to calm your nervous system. So, at the end of the day, it's a very big piece of it, right, like figuring out how, as retiring superwoman, superwomen how do we start calming our nervous system? How do we start engaging our different senses in a way where we're not always upregulated, we're not always on alert, we're not always on the ready, we're not always staying ready, so we don't have to get ready because I'm like, basically, we just saying we always activated and you should?
Aseanté Renee:yeah, right, and so we pick organizations and we pick businesses that can tap into one of your five senses, and so offering a gift to you to tap into one of your five senses, and again at no cost to you, because you should not have to pay. Yeah, we explore some of these things.
Aliya Cheyanne:Yeah, so, yeah, I love that and a couple of things I love that and a couple of things I love how that's one feeding into this larger conversation around the fact that so many of our third spaces are disappearing.
Aliya Cheyanne:So many people are staying home or they're going to work, but the third space where they connect with people, where they practice community care or self-care, is just like disappearing. So even in doing this work, you're recreating those spaces. But I also firmly believe that as much as trauma can be generational, so can healing and so can joy. And I love the tools that so many of us are employing now to experience, now, to live in our bodies, now to pass on to nieces and nephews and children, and it just makes me hopeful, especially during a time where I don't have a lot of hope because the world is crazy about what the future might hold like, what a new generation or generations of healing will look like down the line. So I love this idea of giving us permission to set aside or acknowledge, but also give ourselves a break from the things that we've carried either in our own lives or that are passed down to us, that we didn't ask for, and charting a new course. So I love that.
Aseanté Renee:I got goosebumps when you said healing is generational, joy is generational. Like when we finish this I'm going to probably go write something about that, I will absolutely credit you with it. But that just gave me so much joy because we always talk about, like you know, the comms in both of us, like the communication between both of us, talk about the problem, talk about the solution. It was about trauma's generation. Let's our generational trauma.
Aseanté Renee:We're breaking generational curses yeah yeah, I was like what if we just talk about building generational healing? That? Just thank you for that. Yeah, yeah, like, and not to talk about generational curses, but to be like, let's talk about generational gifts, yeah, yep, let's talk about generational curses. But to be like, let's talk about generational gifts, yeah, yep, let's talk about generational legacies, and so that, yeah, healing is generational, joy is generational. You'll see that again. You'll see that again, aaliyah.
Aliya Cheyanne:Okay, gosh Ashante, this has been so good. I know we're almost at time, so I just want to wrap up with some last questions. And then you know, have you share where the folks can find you? I feel like you shared so much, a lot already, about what this path has taught you so far. Just a lesson that comes to mind right now, or advice that comes to mind right now, just given your experiences launching the axon group, launching susu house, doing the retiring superwoman campaign, working on the recovering perfectionist work and writing a book like what is what? Is something that kind of comes to you right now in terms of a lesson you've learned or advice you'd love to share to someone who wants to chart their own path as well?
Aseanté Renee:Release knowing how it's going to work out. Release knowing how it's going to play out. I'm literally telling myself, like that's not advice I'm giving to other people, it's a lesson for me, yes, especially in the last couple of months. Like what you mean release, the expectation of it looking a certain way, and just because it may not look the way you wanted or anticipated or planned or planned for or desired. One, does it mean it wasn't successful? Yes, and two, does it mean that you're not doing exactly what you're supposed to be doing? Yes, yeah.
Aseanté Renee:Because the things that are put in us, that are entrusted to us, to be birthed into the world like. Not everyone gets the same ideas, not everyone gets the same epiphanies, and if you've been blessed to have one in any capacity, that means you're entrusted with it.
Aliya Cheyanne:Yeah.
Aseanté Renee:And so that also means you're entrusted with it, because it's there to teach you something as well, and so like doing all of these things and also understanding, because at one point.
Aseanté Renee:I was like I'm doing all these different things and how scattered do I look? I'm like actually, no, there's a through line in all of these human giving myself permission to pause, giving myself permission to make mistakes, giving myself permission to fail, giving myself permission to not know how it's going to play out, giving myself permission to pivot. Yes, this route isn't going the way I thought it would. I can pivot and that's still. All of these entities and platforms are a constant teacher and reminder of that for me, so I would want to offer that to other folks as well.
Aliya Cheyanne:I really do hope that you're listening to your own advice in this moment.
Aseanté Renee:So anyone listening, if you ever see this, give you permission now to you know, hold me accountable. You're like maybe that's it On the podcast. You're not doing it. I'm like you're right. Yeah, don't know you, but thank you for sharing.
Aliya Cheyanne:You're right, yeah, yeah, you're right, talking about, you know, just reevaluating the relationship with God and recognizing that God has changed. That stays with me all the time, because if one thing, there's one thing that's going to happen in life, these things are going to change.
Aseanté Renee:No, actionists don't like change. Yeah, you know what healing requires.
Aliya Cheyanne:Change and being able to evolve and grow with that, despite the discomfort, you know, in spite of the discomfort. Okay, lord, okay yeah.
Aseanté Renee:It happens to me there's two. Enjoy it.
Aliya Cheyanne:Yeah, it's hard. It's hard, but it's not necessary. Some days it's a rage room.
Aseanté Renee:Sometimes it's Annie up, sometimes it's not. Yeah, I'm there, let me stop there.
Aliya Cheyanne:All right, Ashante. So let me just ask you what is bringing you joy in this season, right now? I know a lot of things are going on, but what is one thing that's giving you just joy right now? Comfort.
Aseanté Renee:In this exact moment, it's my dog. He keeps trying to joke about it. He's going to make an appearance, oh, Podcast.
Aliya Cheyanne:He's not Gru. He literally keeps like oh, okay, it's up to you. Okay, if you're watching on video, you get to see Little Bishop. My God, he's the cutest. Aww, I just wanted to give his mommy some kisses, yeah.
Aseanté Renee:He's bringing a lot of joy to me right now. The other thing the sun yes, like a lot of joy to me right now. The other thing the sun yeah, like I find myself going outside and just standing in the sun yes and just just standing in the sun and, and, yeah, having those moments of really deep gratitude, like again.
Aseanté Renee:Like I said, you know I'm from the south. I'm very, very uh, prayers that my grandma and great grandmas and like the, the aunties and deaconess would pray that. I'm just grateful that I woke up in my right mind, I'm grateful that my lips, I'm grateful that yeah I was like why would you pray, why would you be thankful for that?
Aseanté Renee:like that's a given? No, it's not. No, yeah, yeah. And so what's bringing me joy is remembering those very basic privileges that I have the ability to breathe air without fear, the ability to eat without concern or worry, the ability to actually be in my my right mind, to be able to walk outside and stand in the sun and not worry about my safety. That does bring me joy, deep gratitude and deep joy.
Aliya Cheyanne:Yeah, I love that. I spoke on a recent episode about just doing some grounding work, like going in the grass barefoot, just releasing whatever I was feeling to the earth and just letting the sun hit me and taking it in slowly wherever I felt the warmth and being very overly present with my body, and so I love that. Shante, thank you so much. This has been such a beautiful conversation. I appreciate you so much. Can you let the folks know where to find you, where to support your work?
Aseanté Renee:Can you let the folks know where to find you, where to support your work? Gosh of the three websites of the three organizations.
Aliya Cheyanne:List them all. List them all. Baby yes.
Aseanté Renee:Yeah, so you have the Axon. I know this will go in your link in the section so Axon group. If you want to do some coaching work Honestly, you know what? How people can support me, because I'm just the name of the thing. Also, I used to be messy in the ask. See, I'm practicing what I'm doing now. I had no Do it, do it. The way I would love for people to support is to donate to the Susu House.
Aliya Cheyanne:Yes.
Aseanté Renee:And you can actually go to susuhouseorg and donate, because all of the money that people donate literally goes right back out into the community to do healing events, to do healing retreats, to do healing workshops, to give scholarships to people if they want to go to other practitioner healing retreats and workshops and they can't afford it the scholarships for folks to be able to go. Do those types of things Like if you've ever had a woman, if you've ever had a super woman in your life that loved on you, nurtured, you, cared for you, got you through, go donate. Yeah, go, go donate as a way of first, go tell them, thank you, first and foremost, go tell that person, thank you, like, as soon as this podcast ends, go. And then, secondly, go donate to the Susu House and that will allow us to do more healing events. It'll allow me to do more things in the community. It allows us to support more practitioners. It'll allow us to support more melanated women. It allows us to do more retiring superwoman events.
Aseanté Renee:Go donate $2,000, $2,000, $2 million. I will take $2 million. And if you know somebody who's willing, a corporation organization, y'all trying to do some healing equity work. You work at a company that's trying to do some healing, equity work and they want to do a scholarship donation. Send us the money, send it to us, yes, yes, I'm going to ask for all the things now. I want that. Yeah, anyone who's on a news talk show y'all know Tamron, y'all know Sherry, y'all know anybody who want to pick this up so we can make this national and help more people. Hit them up. Yep, send it to them, get them involved, help me, help me, help. Yes, yeah, please use your network to help me heal melanated women.
Aliya Cheyanne:Yes, I love that and I will make sure I link to Sisu House in the show notes and ask folks to support your work and to make a donation, and I speak on the show all the time about fostering community and how we can show up for each other. So if you're listening and you feel called to support in this way, please do. That's the end of our episode. Thank you, ashante.
Aseanté Renee:Feels like we just had lunch, like these are what our lunches sound like A working lunch or working in quotes?
Aliya Cheyanne:This is beautiful. You're just a breath of fresh air and so wise and even with all the things that you carry, the fact that you can inspire others is just a testament to the woman you are. So I appreciate you. I appreciate this time with you and, yeah, this has been great. I hope that anyone listening that you also feel inspired and, yeah, thank you.
Aseanté Renee:Can I just say, like Aaliyah, you're absolutely amazing. You know I'm big on giving people their flowers in real life. No, you are. You are one of the smartest people that I know. You are so creative and so caring and so courageous. You are truly charting your own path and from the woman that I met to the woman that I'm seeing now, that courage and that power is palpable.
Aseanté Renee:And you are doing this podcast and it is a healing modality. It is a healing platform for both yourself and other people and just, I don't think people give enough credit to someone having an idea and then bring it to fruition Like that takes so much work and so much audacity and so much tenacity and so much courage. And you have that in spades and I am so thankful for you and I am so grateful for you and I am so blessed to consider you a friend and to be able to witness you on this journey. And I think people listening to your you a friend and to be able to witness you on this journey and I think people listening to your podcast would feel the same way, like you are a trailblazer, change making, powerhouse, dope ass woman and thank you for allowing us to experience your brilliance.
Aliya Cheyanne:Thank you. I wasn't expecting to cry so I'm going to stop the recording. Okay, now that I've composed myself. Ashanti, I just want to say thank you for coming on the show. I loved having you on as a guest. Thank you for being an incredible friend, an incredible mentor and leader and such a special person in my life.
Aliya Cheyanne:To everyone listening, I hope that you enjoyed this episode. If it spoke to you, if it resonated with you, please share it with someone in your network. Please consider Ashanti's call to action. The Susu House is doing such incredible work in the community and it's such an important resource and important tool and in many cases, a lot of the funding, a lot of the grants and all kinds of things are so gatekept and hard for women-owned businesses to access Black women-owned businesses to access marginalized communities period, and it would be world-changing to really get to Sue House the funding that it deserves. If you feel inspired, if you have it within your resources to do so, please consider a donation. If that's not in your wheelhouse, but maybe you know six degrees of separation, you have someone in your network who knows someone who knows someone else. Let's get Susu House the recognition it deserves in today.
Aliya Cheyanne:If you enjoyed this episode. You can send us a text message using the link in the show notes. You can send in a voice note with your thoughts. Have an opportunity to have your voice heard on the podcast. I would love that you can email the show. Email me at podcast at the prolifichugcom, to share any thoughts or feedback you have and let's keep the conversation going. I will catch you all back here next week. Thanks so much for tuning in.
